Bazzite has a very simple process for installing software that isn’t on Flatpak: You spin up a virtual machine running a better distro and install it there
It would be DNF in this case
I love bazzite for handheld consoles but before I install it on my desktop there needs to be version based on ordinary ‘non-immutable’ fedora kde. That being said, immutable distros are more stable
Nobara
Nobara promised me a nice dinner and then punched me in the taint
Usually need to pay extra for that
What’s your problem with the image based OS?
If there’s really anything you need, you can layer it or build your own image quite easily.
I switched from Bazzite to Garuda to get away from it being immutable. It’s been great.
Unlikely to happen. Not only is all their build tooling etc. made for immutable distros (and they have a lot of other ones besides Bazzite), but it would also mean throwing away the biggest advantages for little gain.
I’ve been using it on my laptop for over 6 months now and it has been fantastic.
I mean, if you’re really hardcore, you can build your own immutable distro image using the distro you want… but that’s way above my paygrade. I don’t think it’s that difficult, just something I have no intention of learning.
So, Nobara?
I would have stuck with Nobara, which is the first Linux distro I really tried, but it was maintained by one person and eventually they’re going to get burned out or worse. I figured it would be better to just go with a distro that had a whole team working on it.
rpm-ostree install would like to have a word with you
They do specifically, multiple times, in multiple places in the wiki… tell you that you really, really shouldn’t use rpm-ostree unless you absolutely know exactly what you are doing… because you can run into dependency conflict hell, and then the tree build will fuck up.
Bazzite updates to a newer version of a shared dependency, but something you manually added… has not?
Or visa versa, your custom thing requires a newer version, or some dependency that is for whatever reason just a conflicting fork of an existing dependency?
Something is gonna break, potentially lots of somethings.
I saw that, I’ve been raw doggin it ever since. Maybe one day rpm-ostree would like that have a word with me
Well uh, godspeed i guess, rofl.
It is good at least that rpm ostree has ways to view and manage such conflicts, and rollback to the bazzite image preset (keeps flatpaks and such intact, i think).
Lmao that’s how I feel about it. I want to say that rollback isn’t the easiest thing, I’ve tried to boot further down the tree at one point when discord broke (my only rpm install) and immediately got some errors regarding dependencies, so I had to remove it and reinstall it and it seemed fine after that.
I’ve honestly been thinking about rolling either Debian Ubuntu or arch, but I’m not in a place where I want to fuck with it all again currently.
Edit: I do appreciate you looking out though
they should alias
ujust repent-and-seek-absolutionto some script of thoroughly robust set of rpm ostree conflict identifiers and reset/rollback commands, lol
EDIT: why distrohop, you have distrobox, Do ThIng There, LOL
There’s just a sloppy amount of bullshit that’s stacked up since my switch from windows, clean slate is tempting. I also miss Apt, ironically enough
Ah well I gueas thats fair if you… have indeed already fucked your ostree uh, raw, i think that was the word you used.
It is kind of annoying to not have that direct control, i get that, and i too am super used to debian based distros and apt after about a decade of being in debian or derivatives.
Bazzite is the better distro because you install things in a distrobox. Muck around, break things in there, but your main distro stays safe, secure and stable.
Hmmm. I use QubesOS mainly for the ability to have a separate VM for different things that I can muck around in and not break shit. Does bazzite offer a similar experience?
You don’t run a VM for everything with Bazzite, Distrobox is more like Flatpak or WSL in that regard.
It also isn’t much more secure, it’s just that everything is a bit more contained and comes with their own dependencies.
Eh, it’s fedora under the hood with SELinux enabled, and immutable, better than most security wise, I didn’t say much more.
I replied to @muntedcrocodile@lemm.ee and understood the question like “Is distrobox as secure as QubesOS?”, which I replied with “No”.
I’d say Fedora Atomic is definitely a bit more secure than other distros (e.g. Ubuntu, regular Fedora, etc.) for reasons you mentioned, but if you are a user that thinks that only Qubes offers the security you need, than there’s no alternative.
I can recommend you Secureblue tho as a good middle ground.
It’s Fedora Atomic, but hardened, a bit like GrapheneOS. Still viable for comfortable everyday use, but much more secure.I replied to @muntedcrocodile@lemm.ee and understood the question like “Is distrobox as secure as QubesOS?”, which I replied with “No”.
Ahh, fair cop. Good point on Secureblue, but my threat model doesn’t take me there.
So it’s kinda like a docker container its got its own filesystem and root runtime but not its own kernel?
Distrobox is just a set of shell scripts that controlls Podman under the hood. Not only is it like docker, it literally uses the same container format (ContainerD).
Huh the more u know lol
That is true, but for embedded development it sucks because of specialty drivers, access to dbus, udev rules, etc… And distrobox with vscodium or code oss has some big big slowdowns that I can’t figure out.
Saleae software simply won’t work consistently in distrobox, for example. Luckily they have an app image so I could just install it there and set a few settings and now it works well. Sigrok Pulseview is better but needs a few not-dependency packages to work around it.
There is some weirdness to atomic distros and bazzite, but I am pretty happy with it!
Until the keys change. And you spend forever wondering why it updates every day only to realize it was the same update over and over and over, and the only way they announce they broke things is a GitHub issue.
I love Bazzite, daily it on my gaming PC. But imutable distros do have challenges, and installing non-standard software is defintlately one of them.
Until the keys change. And you spend forever wondering why it updates every day only to realize it was the same update over and over and over, and the only way they announce they broke things is a GitHub issue.
Keys for what? Bazzite? When did this happen?
Oh so before I started using it
Yes, this did happen, but also, they fixed it, and owned up to and totally explained their mistake.
I dunno, I fixed it at the time because I saw the post but I had to go digging a bit. I think they could have done a better job of disseminating that information wider.
I don’t disagree with you that they could have better publicized it.
I think the project got massively more popular more rapidly than the devs expected… and coder type people are rarely also PR type people at the same time.
You can just use
rpm-ostreeif you really need something as a system package. Otherwise toolbx or distrobox if it’s not available as a flatpak. None of these are virtual machinesI don’t technically consider container images as virtual machines proper…but what do I know.
Hey checkout DistroShelf.
I though BoxBuddy was installed by default on uBlue distros? It works quite well, too.
I can confirm that BoxBuddy is installed by default on Bazzite.
I think some people just haven’t read the documentation, and think it’s flatpak or bust.
As a Bazzite fan, lmao. True
Not really though… Not gonna be that annoying guy and repeat what I and others have said elsewhere in the thread, but you should read some of the replies here.
yeah it’s
rpm-ostree install <pkg>what’s the big deal
Bazzite docs repeatedly say ‘do not do that, it will lead to system instability as we update and improve the feature set of our custom rpm-ostree that is the backbone and fundamental core of what Bazzite is.’
It is supposed to be a static, locked down, readonly core OS, just like SteamOS.
Its just based on fedora instead of arch, and has a bunch of other customizations and tweaks and preconfigured apps and helper tools.
fair point
https://docs.bazzite.gg/Installing_and_Managing_Software/rpm-ostree/
so you have to be careful what you add to your base; preferably just self-contained tools that will not interfere with the stability of the system, use distrobox or other container to create larger more sophisticated environments
i used it for an icon theme, amd gpu info tool, android cli tools. they all come from the fedora repos so play nice with the base and i haven’t run into update issues mentioned in the info page
it’s also very easy to
rpm-ostree resetif you do, so it has that safety net
I’m a noob, and I thought Bazzite would be simpler, but when I had an issue (monitor going black under heavy load), I couldn’t solve the problem because of the immutable OS. I went around in circles with Google and ChatGPT, and couldn’t get it to work.
The discord is usually really helpful.
This made me lol today, thank you
Me 10 years ago after deciding to go into the deepend a bit to learn Linux and installing Slackware.
bazzinga
Shibby
its in the ubuntu or debian toolbox. distrobox is pretty freaking awesome.
echo "alias apt='sudo rpm-ostree'" >> .bashrcLMAO.
What are you running Bazzite on? I’m using it on my Legion Go as my daily driver. I love it for the most part, but there’s still plenty to learn.
Not OP, but I’ve got Bazzite on my Steam Deck and Bluefin on my laptop as my daily. I’m rather loving the set it and forget it nature of it while still having plenty of room to play when I need to.
My problem is that I use my Legion Go primarily as a computer for managing servers, coding, web dev, photo and video editing, and then gaming when I get a moment.
Examples of my incredibly nitpicky problems are like wanting to boot into desktop mode, wanting a password prompt on boot/return from sleep, better vram control in desktop mode. Silly things like that.
You can absolutely disable the password from sleep. And there’s different versions of bazzite. There’s the deck versions that go straight into gaming mode and the non deck ones that go to desktop. If you have one installed it’s super easy to switch to the other just from the terminal too using the command on their download and install page.
I think Bazzite has a version that doesn’t start in game mode 🤔 Or use one of the sister versions if you don’t game often? Password on boot happens on both of mine, and coming back from sleep should be an option.
I use bazzite on my desktop.
The problem with the set it and forget it nature is that when updates stop working, it “forgets” to tell you.
If you layer any packages, you will run into this, but even without package layering, there have been a number of bugs reported recently about this.
I have auto updates and notifications on (and I switched them off and on again and verified the settings) and haven’t gotten a single update notification for months even though I can update manually successfully.
